Curse

Free Runner · Jun 11, 2008, 01:08 AM // 01:08

With the Guild Wars 2 lore article released last year, one topic has become very popular in lore forums: Dragons. These are just some observations on the links and purposes of Dragons within the Guild Wars story. Its not exactly finished as i want to add more involveing the various depictions of Dragons in Tyria

Dragons are seen in many fantasy stories and Guild Wars is no exception. Within Tyria there are subspecies of dragon, known as Drakes aswell as Serpentine Dragons (Saltspray Dragons) and even Turtle Dragons. Guild Wars strays from your typical modern depiction of a dragon to the point of people refusing to believe said creature is a subspecies of dragon.

However there are dragons within Tyria that are shown to be powerful and knowledgeable: Glint and Kuunavang. Along with these there are many mysterious references to dragons throughout guild wars in the form of depictions within runes and murals. But overall Glint and Kuunavang are at first shown to be the "true" dragons of the Guild Wars story.

Glint

Glint is the first powerful dragon we come to know about in Guild Wars. Resideing on the continent of Tyria, she was the first creature to be placed on Tyria by the gods to oversee this new world. This was a task she was given along with The Forgotton who were to aid her - she was to be the Caretaker of Tyria.

Glint is located with Dragons Lair which in turn is located in a single grain of sand in the Crystal Desert - its never explained why she hides away like this but it is most likely the same reason The Forgotton took refuge in the Desert. Within her lair she compiles the Flameseeker Prophecies and 800 years later she helps the heroes, even pushing them to fulfill the Prophecies.

She is rather mysterious - never telling the heroes the exact details of the Prophecies but instead allowing them to blindly complete them. After the heroes encounter her in the lair, she does not appear until the defeat of the Flameseeker - and when she does appear it is to congratulate the heroes. After the heroes leave the dragon seems to take the Scepter of Orr that was left behind away with her making us question her motives. She then proceeds to help the player in defeating the titan army that had made it onto Tyria.

From this point on Glint is not heard from again, however within Eye of the North we learn that one of the eggs she kept has hatched meaning there is another dragon around. The exact future of this Baby Dragon is unknown at this time but it is under protection of the Brotherhood of the Dragon (who unfortunatly are Dwarves making their future seem uncertain aswell). During the rise of the Great Destroyer this baby was a target of the Destroyers. It is currently unknown as to if this was a planned attack or just the Destroyers sensing a small power and seeking to destroy it.

So with Glint, Guild Wars added its first powerful Dragon which had apparantly been a creation of the gods. This creation seems to leave out major disasters in the future of Tyria such as Nightfall. Due to this many have questioned as to if Glint was helping us or helping herself - this remains to be seen.

Kuunavang

The second powerful Dragon of Guild Wars. Kuunavang differs from Glint in both looks and lore - while Glint took on the shape of a modern European Dragon, Kuunavang is based more on a Oriental Dragon. Another difference from Glint is she appears to be from a type of dragon that is native to Cantha - the Saltspray Dragon.

Kuunavangs origins are never revealed however she has power equal to Glint. Kuunavang was trapped under the Harvest Temple due to the Jade Wind. Since then she had become corrupted by Shiro until the Luxons and Kurzicks united to defeat her. She then proceeded to help the factions defeat Shiro once and for all. After this her fate, like Glints is unknown - she plays no further role in the future of Tyria.

But where did Kuunavang come from? unlike Glint who was actually given an origin, this dragon is just there. No questions asked. Perhaps Kuunavang was just a unusually powerful Saltspray Dragon? but if that was the case why are there not more? was Kuunavang also created by the gods? we hear about their creations on Tyria but never on Cantha.

So Glint and Kuunavang are the two known powerful dragons of Guild Wars. One was created by the gods and the other just appeared after the Jade Wind.

But aswell as having two major dragons in the lore Guild Wars has many other references to dragons. Lets start with Tyria.

Tyria

Other than having Glint, Tyria seems to have very few dragons (Elona having only a few drakes). But one of the most prominent forces in Tyria are the Undead - and within the Undead we have the Bone Dragons. Now Bone Dragons seem to be rare amongst Tyrians - in one mission a White Mantle Fighter claims he saw one at night.

Many people dont think Bone Dragons are actually dragons due to their appearence however others say that their appearence is that of half a dragon. This is still up for speculation. While you would say Bone Dragons are just minor dragons they do infact have a entity who, while not on the same level as Glint or Kuunavang, is widely known - Rotscale.

Rotscale In Tyria

Rotscale is a Bone Dragon animated by the Stone Summit near Ascalon. Rotscale is powerful to the point of being able to trek through Tyria and survive attempts to kill it. It made its way through the Shiverpeaks and eventually to Majestys Rest where it gained a small entourage. Rotscale doesnt seem to have a master or a purpose or objective. However why is this Bone Dragon more powerful than the others? what type of dragon was it before its death and animation?

The Bone Dragons were some sort of Dragon creature in Tyria - but what though?

Cantha

Quote:

Originally Posted by Manuscripts

Dragons of all shapes, sizes, and origin have called Cantha home for thousands of years, since long before the tribes of old joined to form the empire that took them as its symbol.

Dragons appear to have a deep connection to Cantha. Its empire is know as the Empire of the Dragon. Almost everywere statues of dragons can be seen throughout Kaineng City. The many subspecies of dragon, from the Rock Dragons to the Saltspray, all inhabit Cantha. This suggests that Cantha has something that drew the dragons to it.

Kuunavang is Canthas answer to Glint, and appears to be known throughout Cantha while Glint was known to an extent in Tyria. Another interesting thing is that all the dragons seem to be in the Jade Sea. While a few inhabit Shing Jea Islands western coasts, there are more in the Jade Sea.

Elona

Strangely enough little to no dragons are in Elona. Apart from the minor few drakes there are no major groups of subspecies to the dragons in Elona. There isnt even a powerful Dragon the likes of Glint and Kuunavang in Elona.

Dragons of Guild Wars 1

So in Guild Wars 1, dragons are featured but dont play as the main story plot too much. Sure Glint and Kuunavang are involved in the story but they dont make many appearences. In the Guild Wars 1 story the dragons are simply beings left by the gods to handle Tyria. Nothing more nothing less.

And then comes along Guild Wars 2....

The Ancient Dragons

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Originally Posted by Decimus the Historian

Never trust the past. There has been too much forgotten, too many things hidden beneath the sand of ages. Even your own memory can lie to you...

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Originally Posted by Dragons

These were both caused by the surfacing of ancient powers—true dragons, more dangerous than anything Tyria has ever known before. Glint and Kuunavang were but youths, lesser powers to the ancients that came before. These mystic and terrifying creatures rival the gods themselves.

And here it is we learn that Glint and Kuunavang are no longer the powerful dragons of Guild Wars. We learn that infact they were the lesser dragons to a more sinister, terrifying breed of Dragons - Also known as the Ancient Dragons.

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Originally Posted by Dragons

Primordus was the first of the ancient dragons to awaken, calling his servants from their slumber. With his breath, he twisted earth and stone, shaping creatures and giving them life. Although the death of the Great Destroyer, his most powerful general, set back the dragon's awakening by two generations, Primordus once again rose to create ever more minions far beneath the ground. To this day, he continues to spread his power throughout the deep caverns beneath Tyria.

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Originally Posted by Dragons

The rise of the dragon beneath Orr caused the entire continent to surface, sparking a tidal wave that swept the coastline and drowned thousands. In the deepest waters of the sea, another dragon breathed, twisting the waters themselves into tentacled horrors that rose from every lake and river of the land. Only a few years ago, yet another dragon erupted from the northern mountains and flew south over the Charr territory of Ascalon. The land directly below the path of the dragon’s flight was corrupted, becoming a crater of horror. The ground blackened from the dragon's presence and any creatures caught within the wind of its breath twisted and changed.

So after the many fights of Tyria it is revealed that these Ancient Dragons were in fact here from the beginning, unknown to any of the races and possibly the gods themselves. Dragons have always been on the side of the heroes, helping them and making them believe they were the first of their kind.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dragons

Although these creatures are called dragons, they are as different from Kuunavang and Glint as night to day—more powerful, older, born of different, unfathomable magic, these horrors are controlled by no god nor any other power known to the races of Tyria. What connection they have to these "younger dragons" is unknown, but they certainly do not possess the mercy or familiarity with the sentient races of the world that Kuunavang or Glint portray.

The cycle of their awakening reaches back to the time of the giganticus lupicus, and even further, back into prehistory. The only thing known about these monsters is that they have no pity, no curiosity—no concern at all for the other races of the world. Their only goal seems to be to dominate, to control, and to destroy

Are these dragons the "real" dragons of Guild Wars? while all the time we thought Glint and Kuunavang were powerful, we get shown that they are mearly babies compared to the Ancient Dragons who appear to have the ability to create life itself.

So what are dragons in Guild Wars? the mythical creatures that possess knowledge and power or beasts with the power to destroy the world?

Appearences of The Ancient Dragons

There are three visible dragons featured in Eye of the North. Each one "blends" in to its surroundings. However while they are all Ancient Dragons they look very different when compared to each other.

There are a total of five confirmed dragons with one unconfirmed dragon. Currently each of the five dragons rule over certain areas of Tyria. These areas are The Depths of Tyria, The Sea of Sorrows, Orr, The Crystal Desert and the Far Shiverpeaks.

Primordus

Due to his actual appearence being covered by rock we cannot see anything other than his general outline. And that itself is strange. To make things easier i have labeled the things i will address:

The first point is A. This appears to be one of many tenticles coming down from Primordus. Point B is one of the arms that connect the tenticles to his body. When you look at this its almost like The Great Destroyer, Primordus's general. While he doesnt move around on tenticles he has the same limbs and even the same body and neck in a way. Underneath Primordus's head you can see his body which appears to be round - just like the Great Destroyer. His neck is long, allowing him to bow his head in a position that faces his body. The rest of his body is hidden in the wall so we cant tell if he also has wings. Judgeing from the fact he rules the depths in Guild Wars 2, he probably wont need or have wings.

The mural you see was actually done before Factions even came out, meaning it originally had nothing to do with the dragons. However its possible now that ArenaNet have taken the basic look of Primordus off this piece of concept art.

The Dragon of Snow and Ice

Credit for the pictures goes to Malchior and his thread Drakkar Lake ice creature screens - The reason for my use of his screenshots is that his graphics cards limits allowed him to take clear pictures of the dragon without the ice getting in the way

We still dont have a name for this Dragon but it is described as a Dragon of Snow and Ice. This dragon is found frozen in Drakkar Lake (which appears to have been named after it). It is the first dragon hinted at after Svanir, Joras brother, uses a spell to reveal the nature of the lake and becomes corrupted. Its possibly this evil nature that draws Chilling Whisps into the area. Another thing eerie about the dragon is this:

As you can see (look at the characters neck and Mhenlos back) a mysterious light is coming up from the dragon. Now this could be from ArenaNets design of the lake, however its only over the dragon. Getting back to the dragon it at first glance looks like a dragon that would dwell in water to some, however this dragon appears to have frozen on land. If it froze itself or it simply went to sleep and became frozen is unknown (though i would put money on the first one).

While this dragon remains nameless, it has been nicknamed by players as "Drakkar". This nickname is unofficial and stems from the area the dragon is found in known as Drakkar Lake.

Dragon of Grothmar Wardowns

This dragon curves alot and a mysterious mist surrounds areas of it. However due to its distance we cant investigate it further until GW2. Speaking of which in GW2 a dragon is supposed to appear from the Northen Mountains and fly to the south corrupting everything under it. However this dragon seems to be lacking wings. It may be that it has them hidden underground.

While this dragon is nameless it has been nicknamed by players as "Grothmar". This nickname is unofficial and stems from the area it resides in known as Grothmar Wardowns.

This dragon is probably the mysterious "Desert Dragon" mentioned twice in the Movement of the World. See below for reasons why.

Others

The Undead Dragon of Orr

Note: This was titled Undead Dragon. It is unknown if it really is "the" Undead Dragon of Orr.

The Undead Dragon of Orr resides under Arah and is responsible for Orr riseing from the sea. This dragon commands and Undead Armarda that sails the sea of sorrows sinking anything in its path only for the victims to become part of it. The Movement of the World states that this dragon is "more terrifying and more powerful than any being on Tyria". While its not clear if the other Ancient Dragons are included in this assumption, the dragon surely has shown its power.

The Undead Dragon, also known as the Orrian Dragon, has been unofficially nicknamed "Malchor" for easier reference. While its true name is unknown, the name Malchor came from a part of the sea near Orrs new name in GW2 - The Strait of Malchor.

The Dragon of the Deep Sea

This Dragon sleeps somewere at the bottom of the Sea of Sorrows. It is known that its breath has "breathed life" into the sea itself causing tenticles to rise out onto the banks of Tyria.

The Mysterious Desert Dragon

Thoughout the Movement of the World a "desert dragon" is mentioned. While it has yet to be confirmed if this dragon is seperate from already mentioned dragons, many parts of Movement of the World hint at it being the dragon "Grothmar".

The MotW indicates Grothmar flew over Ascalon but it never confirms where he landed. And the desert dragon, never mentioned in the passage explaining how each dragon emerged from their slumber, is located in the Northen Desert - the place Grothmar would of ended up. And last but not least the desert dragons twisted victims have been attacking the Charr in Ascalon - and Grothmar was known to have twisted many creatures on his flight over.

So in short, coupled with Grothmars lack of mention and the desert dragons random appearence, it would seem likely that the desert dragon is Grothmar. This however has yet to be confirmed by Anet.

NOTE: There are things in the GW world that look like possible candidates for the Ancient Dragons but are infact explained.

These include:
The Two Serpents inside Underworld (Two Brothers who challenged Grenth and were turned into Serpents as explained by the Reaper guarding over that area)

The dragon head in Sunjiang District (This is just a statue)

The Statues/Lighthouse things off the coast of Kaineng City

The centipede-like creatures inside blocks of Jade (These are Leviathans)

The serpent inside some of the Heroes Ascent maps (These are just scenery)

The Dragon head near the Saltspray Dragon Shrine (Scenery)

Konig Des Todes · Jun 11, 2008, 01:34 AM // 01:34

First thing to say. Dang it, beat me to researching this.

Anyways, well researched, probably would have done a little less of a job myself, but, there is something I would like to add. Two types of Kraits, the Krait Arcanoss, which resembles the Bone Dragon, and the Krait Devouss which resembles a Saltspray Dragon. I believe that the bone dragons might have come from the Krait Arcanoss. I doubt that the Kraits can be considered a subspecies of Dragons, but it is always good to keep in mind.

For the Bone dragon, I too think that they are simply half of a dragon. Excluding the Krait Arcanoss, I do not think that there would be a dragon-resembling species that, literally, drags itself around, while also having wings. The reason why the arcanoss probably has the snake-like end and drags itself around, is probably because it is the evolved form of yet another snake-species.

I can't find anything I disagree with and I must say good work on your research. As for your final question, in Guild Wars, I think they are the mythical creatures that possess knowledge and power. And as I say, knowledge leads to corruption, because with knowledge, one would see all the evil in the world, and want to, in their mind, "purify" it by destroying the world, which will destroy the corruption and evil's influence. But thats just a reoccurring theme in many "smart evil enemies" in many many TV shows and Games I've played.

Edit: here's a thought I just got, what if all those saltspray dragons are the children of Kuunavang? Which would explain why they aren't as powerful as Kuunavang herself. Also, I remember there being a quest regarding a rather powerful/important Saltspray dragon, called Albax, that was upset by a NPC in Leviathan Pits.

poasiods · Jun 11, 2008, 02:50 AM // 02:50

Albax seemed rather important. He/she f-ed up this guy's entire life by simply being pissed at him. The quest felt alot like a comic relief of a sort though.

Just a few things I'm wondering about. Where did you find out that Kuunavang answers to Glint? I never managed to establish a connection between the two.

Also, there are dragons in Shing Jea Island? Are they only present there during the Dragon Festival or have I missed something big over there?

I wonder if Glint affected Cantha at all. Despite the lore's confusing use of the term Tyria (sometimes just Tyria, other times, all of the worlds), there are never any serpents or any huge traces of Gods to be found in Cantha at all. The description of Glint says she's the oldest creature on Tyria created by the Gods - meaning there probably are older creatures not created by the gods in Tyria or other continents. I think it could be possible that Kuunavang and other Saltspray dragons were 'chilling' in the Jade Seas for a very long time even before the gods came by. For all we know, they could be offsprings from the Ancient Dragons (I mean, dragons have to come from something, don't they? Who can make the more likely candidates than the ancient dragons?).

Konig Des Todes · Jun 11, 2008, 03:04 AM // 03:04

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Originally Posted by poasiods

Just a few things I'm wondering about. Where did you find out that Kuunavang answers to Glint? I never managed to establish a connection between the two.

You misread. Kuunavang is Cantha's answer to Glint, meaning that Cantha's version of Glint is Kuunavang.

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Also, there are dragons in Shing Jea Island? Are they only present there during the Dragon Festival or have I missed something big over there?

Turtle Dragons are a subspecies of Dragons, much like Drakes. Those are on Shing Jea.

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I wonder if Glint affected Cantha at all. Despite the lore's confusing use of the term Tyria (sometimes just Tyria, other times, all of the worlds), there are never any serpents or any huge traces of Gods to be found in Cantha at all. The description of Glint says she's the oldest creature on Tyria created by the Gods - meaning there probably are older creatures not created by the gods in Tyria or other continents. I think it could be possible that Kuunavang and other Saltspray dragons were 'chilling' in the Jade Seas for a very long time even before the gods came by. For all we know, they could be offsprings from the Ancient Dragons (I mean, dragons have to come from something, don't they? Who can make the more likely candidates than the ancient dragons?).

Both Glint and Kuunavang are offsprings of the Ancient Dragons (at least how I understand it) and the whole "Glint is the oldest creation of the Gods" might be a hoax to try to hide up the Ancient Dragons existence, much like how the Gods tried to remove knowledge of Abaddon after he was exiled. And as I said in my post above, I think that the other Saltspray Dragons might be the children of Kuunavang, who's to know (and maybe Albax is the oldest of them).

Ubin4 · Jun 11, 2008, 03:08 AM // 03:08

im not to big on gw lore, but maybe the gods tried to glint to destroy the other ancient dragons, but since she wasn't powerful enough they had to flee the tyria. Maybe the gods and ancient dragons were waging war or something.

Free Runner · Jun 11, 2008, 11:37 AM // 11:37

The reason i did not add connections to the krait is because of Anets use of reskining monsters. The Shadow Army use the White Mantle casters model and skin yet have no connection whatsoever. The same could be said for Krait and Bone Dragons.

Also Krait are native to the Tarnished Coast yet Bone Dragons are found alongside the Orrian Undead in Kryta. And Rotscale was raised near Ascalon so you have to ask how did a Krait get from the Tarnished Coast to Ascalon. The closest a Bone Dragon has been found to the Tarnished Coast is the areas around Sanctum Kay and inside the Riverside Province.

poasiods · Jun 11, 2008, 11:48 AM // 11:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Azazel The Assassin

Both Glint and Kuunavang are offsprings of the Ancient Dragons (at least how I understand it) and the whole "Glint is the oldest creation of the Gods" might be a hoax to try to hide up the Ancient Dragons existence, much like how the Gods tried to remove knowledge of Abaddon after he was exiled.

Don't think Glint would be working for Gods if she knew that was what they were up to...

Konig Des Todes · Jun 11, 2008, 11:58 AM // 11:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by poasiods

Don't think Glint would be working for Gods if she knew that was what they were up to...

Why do you say that? Its fairly easy to be a "renegade" from your family, Glint could be the same, or she might not have been really working for the gods, the term double agent comes into mind here. Or, she might not be working for the gods at all, maybe she is helping the characters because that is what the prophecy told her to do, and for the Forgotten helping Glint, maybe they are wayward from the rest of their kind which are in the Realm of Torment.

Another thought is that Glint could be working for the gods against her will. Why does Glint stay in that single shard of sand? Maybe it is a prison for her and the Forgotten are her jailers, like with Abaddon. Just a possibility that I came up with.

Also, should this be brought up, a reason for Kuunavang to help the players is to get revenge on Shiro for trying to corrupt and control her.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Free Runner

The reason i did not add connections to the krait is because of Anets use of reskining monsters. The Shadow Army use the White Mantle casters model and skin yet have no connection whatsoever. The same could be said for Krait and Bone Dragons.

Also Krait are native to the Tarnished Coast yet Bone Dragons are found alongside the Orrian Undead in Kryta. And Rotscale was raised near Ascalon so you have to ask how did a Krait get from the Tarnished Coast to Ascalon. The closest a Bone Dragon has been found to the Tarnished Coast is the areas around Sanctum Kay and inside the Riverside Province.

The whole reskin thing is the only reason why I can see the Krait and Bone Dragon connection being flawed. For the location argument, it is very easy that the Corsairs who took refuge slew some Krait Arcanoss and brought them to Orr (for a trophy or meat), seeing how the Corsairs became undead (through treachery and a deal with the Vizier), it is possible that they served the lich down there and turned some kraits into those bone dragons. The only argument against that idea other then the reskin argument would be Rotscale. I can't think of any way that would explain Rotscale being a krait, so that would ruin my theory I suppose.

Free Runner · Jun 11, 2008, 05:31 PM // 17:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Azazel The Assassin

Both Glint and Kuunavang are offsprings of the Ancient Dragons (at least how I understand it) and the whole "Glint is the oldest creation of the Gods" might be a hoax to try to hide up the Ancient Dragons existence, much like how the Gods tried to remove knowledge of Abaddon after he was exiled.

Not exactly.

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Although these creatures are called dragons, they are as different from Kuunavang and Glint as night to day—more powerful, older, born of different, unfathomable magic, these horrors are controlled by no god nor any other power known to the races of Tyria. What connection they have to these "younger dragons" is unknown, but they certainly do not possess the mercy or familiarity with the sentient races of the world that Kuunavang or Glint portray.

This passage seems to imply that while they are dragons they are entirely different from Glint of Kuunavang in power,birth and age. If Glint and Kuunavang were offspring then there would surely be more connections rather than them being dragons. What about this mysterious power the Ancients have? why dont Glint and Kuunavang have something like it? sure they are rather powerful amongst the current creatures in Tyria but they dont rival the gods themselves.

It would be interesting to know if ether of them actually knew about the Ancients. Also: are the Ancient Dragons the source of all known dragons in the guild wars world? something happened causing them to sleep until a determined time and it doesnt sound like it was forced sleep considering Primordus had plans in motion to wake up again. Did they for their last act breathe life into the dragon race?

Konig Des Todes · Jun 11, 2008, 05:45 PM // 17:45

I always figured that because Glint and Kuunavang are not as old as the Ancient Dragons, they wouldn't be as powerful. We don't know how old these ancient dragons are, maybe with dragons, the older the stronger. Also, just because Glint and Kuunavang lack a type of power doesn't mean that they are not related. Or perhaps they do have that power but are not showing it for whatever reason they have not to. I don't think they rival the gods, but I have a feeling that they act weaker then they really are (and for game purposes, they were made weak like Abaddon was).

And with your question, your basically asking if how I viewed the connection to be true, seemingly you agree with me. I never said that they were a Direct offspring. Offspring doesn't necessarily mean son or daughter, but descendant. Or at least thats how I meant it. For all we know, the Giganticus Lupicus could have been dragons as well and the direct children of the Ancient Dragons, possibly some could be parents to Glint and Kuunavang, that of course is all speculation.

Sophitia Leafblade · Jun 12, 2008, 11:54 AM // 11:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Azazel The Assassin

And with your question, your basically asking if how I viewed the connection to be true, seemingly you agree with me. I never said that they were a Direct offspring. Offspring doesn't necessarily mean son or daughter, but descendant. Or at least thats how I meant it. For all we know, the Giganticus Lupicus could have been dragons as well and the direct children of the Ancient Dragons, possibly some could be parents to Glint and Kuunavang, that of course is all speculation.

Im glad someone mentioned the "Giganticus Lupicus", im no language expert but i believe the meaning to be something like giant Lizards or Serpents which to me has always said “dragon” much like Dinosaur (Terror Lizard) is used in the real World etc. So I would Guess Primordus and his Brood are the GL’s who vanished from the world Long ago.

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Originally Posted by Free Runner

So after the many fights of Tyria it is revealed that these Ancient Dragons were in fact here from the beginning, unknown to any of the races and possibly the gods themselves.

The reason it has been said the Gods don’t know of them could be perhaps that that the current gods were not gods of that time (much like Koromir is a current god now but wasn’t Pre-Nightfall) as it is unknown what knowledge gets passed on in the “replacing.”

Enko · Jun 16, 2008, 02:22 AM // 02:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Azazel The Assassin

For the Bone dragon, I too think that they are simply half of a dragon. Excluding the Krait Arcanoss, I do not think that there would be a dragon-resembling species that, literally, drags itself around, while also having wings. The reason why the arcanoss probably has the snake-like end and drags itself around, is probably because it is the evolved form of yet another snake-species.

the bone dragons might have to drag themselves around instead of flying since they don't have flesh on their wings, they just have the skeletal bones. unless they have a specific magical ability to fly just by will and not by the physical properties of wings, bone dragons won't be able to fly.

rennis · Jun 16, 2008, 02:36 AM // 02:36

I've always thought of Bone Dragons as being more of a bone golem made to look like a dragon instead of a re-animated Dragon.

Free Runner · Jun 16, 2008, 01:07 PM // 13:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by rennis

I've always thought of Bone Dragons as being more of a bone golem made to look like a dragon instead of a re-animated Dragon.

That could very well be the case. However i still think Bone Dragons were originally a lesser species or should i say a sub species of dragon.

Quote:

And with your question, your basically asking if how I viewed the connection to be true, seemingly you agree with me. I never said that they were a Direct offspring. Offspring doesn't necessarily mean son or daughter, but descendant. Or at least thats how I meant it. For all we know, the Giganticus Lupicus could have been dragons as well and the direct children of the Ancient Dragons, possibly some could be parents to Glint and Kuunavang, that of course is all speculation.

Actually i was talking about the subspecies of dragon found around the area. I suppose Kuunavang has been given no real origin but Glint has been stated to be created by the gods. Until it is stated that this was a lie, this origin still stands.

Steps_Descending · Jun 17, 2008, 10:35 PM // 22:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Free Runner

I suppose Kuunavang has been given no real origin but Glint has been stated to be created by the gods. Until it is stated that this was a lie, this origin still stands.

It has been stated that the order of whisper olds the only true history of Tyria, the one we know being half-lies,half-truth. The true history will be used to overwrite illogical lore concerning (I guess) the gods/dragon background.
When that is we may learn a relation between Koonavung(sp?), Glint and the Dragon. But untill then the only infos we have state that Glint is a creation of the gods, everything else we have seen so far is speculation.

Concerning Rotscale's animation, where did you take that rotscale was first animated by stone summit?

EDIT:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ablax

Most of my kin were corrupted by the Jade Wind two hundred years ago. Yet only I remain, the sole living incarnation of good fortune in all the land

That meakes me think that Ablax is not so special for a Saltspray, he would simply be (one of) the last dragon that doesn't attack any human on sight. That would imply that any Saltspray originally had such power over daily life.

And also that Koonavung(how do you spell that???) may be much closer to the other saltspray. She was traped in jade and corupted, so she may be considered by Ablax as a Saltspray. She may be a major kind of saltspray, meaning the other would be trapped, half-corrupted or remaining unseen as far as the game goes (we after all do not see the life of every single Luxon). Or be closer to a "mother" dragon. I personally prefer to see har as a saltspray, which does not forbit the mother alternative completely.

Siadena · Jun 18, 2008, 12:52 AM // 00:52

I'm interested in the here and now fun questions, lol:
-When do we see a "mini" Glint?
-Glint vs. Kuunavang in a fight - WHO WOULD WIN! (lets see this in GW2 or something, lol)
-Necro Death skill "Summon Bone Dragon" with like restrictions as "Flesh Golem"

Bring it on!

Gmr Leon · Jun 18, 2008, 06:09 AM // 06:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Siadena

I'm interested in the here and now fun questions, lol:
-When do we see a "mini" Glint?
-Glint vs. Kuunavang in a fight - WHO WOULD WIN! (lets see this in GW2 or something, lol)
-Necro Death skill "Summon Bone Dragon" with like restrictions as "Flesh Golem"

Bring it on!

What does any of that have to do with the GW Lore?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steps_Descending

Concerning Rotscale's animation, where did you take that rotscale was first animated by stone summit?

It was part of a very early story during the beta of GW. Whether or not it should be held as relevant today is up to whomever.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steps_Descending

It has been stated that the order of whisper olds the only true history of Tyria, the one we know being half-lies,half-truth.

Could you cite a source? I do know that the Order of Whispers does protect certain bits of Tyrian history that others now nothing of, but I have heard nothing of them holding the "true" history of Tyria. Not that I'd doubt it if it were true, I'd just like to see a source. I searched through my copy of the Nightfall Manuscripts and couldn't find a thing mentioning anything close to what you're describing.

Edit: Mayhaps you were referring to this line from the Movement of the World article?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Movement of the World, Order of Whispers

Stored far above the rising waters, these antiquities remain the only true records of the ancient age of humanity.

Konig Des Todes · Jun 18, 2008, 06:37 AM // 06:37

I believe that is what Steps meant, however, that is true records of human history, not Tyrian history. There is a difference. Also, if that is not what was meant, the Order of Whispers probably wouldn't have the true history anyways as the organization was founded during the time of Joko's defeat, so unless they stole all the knowledge from the Domain of Secrets or something (which is possible) they would have the same knowledge that would be in historians' access.

Free Runner · Jun 18, 2008, 01:08 PM // 13:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steps_Descending

It has been stated that the order of whisper olds the only true history of Tyria, the one we know being half-lies,half-truth. The true history will be used to overwrite illogical lore concerning (I guess) the gods/dragon background.
When that is we may learn a relation between Koonavung(sp?), Glint and the Dragon. But untill then the only infos we have state that Glint is a creation of the gods, everything else we have seen so far is speculation.

Concerning Rotscale's animation, where did you take that rotscale was first animated by stone summit?

The Order of Whispers are humans.They hold the only history recorded because the flood wiped out most other areas holding this history. So they hold the history we infact have right now (of course their version will have everything from Kormirs ascension to the Dragons appearence)- the history that says Glint was created by the gods. So i'm not exactly sure where your going with that.

Also Rotscales animation story was like GmrLeon said in the betas. I took that as its main origin since it doesnt seem to have been given a new story.

Steps_Descending · Jun 18, 2008, 02:37 PM // 14:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by GmrLeon

Could you cite a source? I do know that the Order of Whispers does protect certain bits of Tyrian history that others know nothing of, but I have heard nothing of them holding the "true" history of Tyria. Not that I'd doubt it if it were true, I'd just like to see a source. I searched through my copy of the Nightfall Manuscripts and couldn't find a thing mentioning anything close to what you're describing.

You remember they protect certain bits, we probably are talking abou the same thing. Tought I remember understanding it as they would edit some part of the lore. And so far I don't see a strong reason to put the knowledge we have now in the hand of the order of whisper exclusively.
I cannot cite a source, but I remember that info was part of the first wave of info released about the lore after GW1, I think from the PC gamer magazine.
I will check if I can find online pages from that time to clean this up.